Delta Virtual Airlines Water Cooler - Google Fiber and/or IPV6

Delta Virtual Airlines Water Cooler | PC Support | Google Fiber and/or IPV6

DVA12754
Captain, B777-200
OLP

Joined on September 13 2015
50 State Club
Globetrotter
US Mountaineer Club
Online Double Century Club
US Coastal Club
DVA Five-Year Anniversary
Two Million Mile Club
Bi-Millennium Club
Everett 1500 Club

Kansas City, MO

2,303 legs, 5,724.2 hours
269 legs, 756.9 hours online
2,191 legs, 5,279.6 hours ACARS
1 legs, 3.1 hours event

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 18:18 ET by Anthony Kring

Not sure if right forum. Anyway, I have noted for about a month my connection to deltava.org AND via ACARS is painfully slow. Like click, wait 10-15 seconds and then it will reply. ACARS usually times our 3-4 times before it finally connects. Didn't see anything else in the Water Cooler or people complaining so I assume it is on my end. However, it is making the experience very poor.

On a hunch last night, I disabled IPV6 support in the network stack on my Win 10 PC - the problem instantly went away. Clearly IPV6 was the contributing factor. What I DON'T know is if it was how IPV6 interfaced with the VA (I always get a friendly message on the website thanking me for using it) OR if its a function of how my provider (Google Fiber) implemented it.

Anyone else have the same issues with IPV6 and can lend any feedback?

Anthony Kring

Captain, B777-200

DVA043
Senior Captain, MD-11
OLP

Joined on June 10 2001
Event Half Century Club
Online Double Century Club
50 State Club
DVA Twenty-Year Anniversary
Everett 1500 Club
Bi-Millennium Club
Four Million Mile Club

"Col. Panic"
Marietta, GA

2,347 legs, 9,466.0 hours
240 legs, 553.9 hours online
2,005 legs, 8,259.1 hours ACARS
75 legs, 196.3 hours event
2,383 legs, 9,600.9 hours total
91 legs dispatched, 66.4 hours

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 18:26 ET by Luke Kolin

You should talk to Andrew Vane - he has the same IPv6 problems with Google Fiber. I have a decent number of folks connecting using IPv6 and the only problems reported have been using Google as the ISP, but it's a sample set of 2.

Out of curiosity, what does an IPv6 traceroute to our server look like? I wonder if it's a connection issue, or reverse DNS?

Cheers!

Luke Kolin

Senior Captain, MD-11

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 18:32 ET by Luke Kolin

FWIW, on AT&T uVerse in Atlanta I'm getting ~45ms ping times to the server on IPv6.

Cheers!

Luke Kolin

Senior Captain, MD-11

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 18:41 ET by Anthony Kring

Luke Kolin wrote:

You should talk to Andrew Vane - he has the same IPv6 problems with Google Fiber. I have a decent number of folks connecting using IPv6 and the only problems reported have been using Google as the ISP, but it's a sample set of 2.

Out of curiosity, what does an IPv6 traceroute to our server look like? I wonder if it's a connection issue, or reverse DNS?

Cheers!

Looks to be routing or conn. I will re-enable and do a traceroute when done and publish here. Glad to know it's not an IPV6 issue but rather fiber. Sounds almost like a peering issue like you would see years ago....

Anthony Kring

Captain, B777-200

DVA2887
Senior Captain, A320
OLP, 737-ATP, VFRADV

Joined on January 30 2006
50 State Club
Globetrotter
Tri-Jet Triumph
US Coastal Club
Millennium Club
DVA Fifteen-Year Anniversary
US Mountaineer Club
Toulouse 250 Club
Online Eight Century

Charlotte, NC

1,287 legs, 1,796.9 hours
841 legs, 1,048.5 hours online
1,269 legs, 1,774.9 hours ACARS
31 legs, 49.6 hours event
3 legs dispatched, 2.5 hours

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 18:51 ET by Andrew Vane

Here is the solution Anthony. For some reason, the google fiber box does not handle ipv6 web sites for some reason. i have notified google fiber about this.

The fix is to disable it by editing the registry. Here is how to do it:

http://tweaks.com/windows/40099/how-to-properly-disable-ipv6/

Once I did this on my computer, voila! no delays. I did not do this on my laptop and I get the same lag. I also did not do anything on my android and the same delay occurs on wifi. On verizon 4G it does not lag. Hopefully this will help.

smile

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 18:52 ET by Anthony Kring

Ok, so on IPV6 across 75 packets, the average latency was 33ms. This is Google Fiber in Kansas City.

Here is a snip of IPV6 traceroute to www.deltava.org which resolves to iris.deltava.org...

Tracing route to iris.deltava.org [2600:1f18:2114:e101::2:2]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms <1 ms <1 ms 2605:a601:afe:9a00::1
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 13 ms 12 ms 12 ms 2605:a601:ffff:9009:1e:f1ba:0:1d
4 12 ms 11 ms 12 ms 2620:107:4008:b8::1
5 * * * Request timed out.
6 37 ms 37 ms 37 ms 2620:107:4000:ff::58
7 34 ms 32 ms 32 ms 2620:107:4000:ff::62
8 37 ms 37 ms 37 ms 2620:107:4000:9::18
9 * * * Request timed out.
10 38 ms 37 ms 38 ms 2620:107:4000::17
11 * * * Request timed out.
12 33 ms 36 ms 32 ms 2620:107:4000::89
13 * * * Request timed out.
14 33 ms 33 ms 33 ms 2620:107:4000::60
15 33 ms 32 ms 33 ms 2620:107:4000::56
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 * * * Request timed out.
18 * * * Request timed out.
19 * * * Request timed out.
20 * * * Request timed out.
21 33 ms 33 ms 33 ms iris.deltava.org [2600:1f18:2114:e101::2:2]

Trace complete.

Anthony Kring

Captain, B777-200

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 19:03 ET by Luke Kolin

It looks like the network connection is fast enough; if you view the page in Chrome developer tools and view the timeline I wonder what the delay is?

Cheers!

Luke Kolin

Senior Captain, MD-11

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 19:07 ET by Anthony Kring

No earthly idea what is going on yet. Going to harass the folks at Google Fiber here shortly.

Anthony Kring

Captain, B777-200

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 19:58 ET by Andrew Vane

I had the same fast ping results. Hopefully they will find my help desk issue in their knowledge base. I even emailed them the fix I found. I had no issues with my spectrum modem.

Andrew Vane (DVA2887)

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 20:54 ET by Anthony Kring

Well, I have a ticket in to them now (GF). No reply as yet - will let ya'll know what I find.

Thanks!

Anthony Kring

Captain, B777-200

Posted onPost created on May 14 2017 21:13 ET by Luke Kolin

See if you can benchmark the page in your browser's performance tools. I'm curious whether it's DNS lookup, SSL or something else.

Cheers!

Luke Kolin

Senior Captain, MD-11

Posted onPost created on May 15 2017 23:57 ET by Anthony Kring

Have not done much more Luke, sorry. I did chat with support (GF) again tonight. They forwarded the issue on to engineers with an estimated response time of 5-7 days.

Anthony Kring

Captain, B777-200

DVA12946
First Officer, CRJ-200
OLP

Joined on April 10 2016
50 State Club
Piranha Club
DVA One-Year Anniversary
Century Club
Black Pearl Club
Everett Century Club

Moncks Corner, SC

166 legs, 397.7 hours
10 legs, 18.7 hours online
165 legs, 396.4 hours ACARS

Posted onPost created on May 16 2017 00:02 ET by Matthew Frazier

I have C spire fiber and they totally disable IPv6. Don't even use it. Don't know if that is an option.

Matthew Frazier

First Officer, CRJ-200

Posted onPost created on May 16 2017 18:58 ET by Anthony Kring

Google came back to say that the issue is on the website. I've pushed back asking for the technical data proving such an assertion.

I have access to a number of providers ....Google is the ONLY ONE having this issue.

Not sure I want to get into a fight with them over internet tech OR routing however! smile

Anthony Kring

Captain, B777-200

Posted onPost created on May 20 2017 13:26 ET by Anthony Kring

For anyones information, they came back (GF) to tell me it's CLEARLY on DVA end. They put IPV6 up on their CPE stack and were unable reproduce. Their routing shows now issues, DNS is proper, and I clearly have more then enough bandwidth. The only perceptible issue they could find was what they called packet loss on the IPV6 traceroute. But, that's likely just ICMP filtering. Whatever. Looks like I won't be getting anywhere with this issue.

Anthony Kring

Captain, B777-200

Posted onPost created on May 20 2017 20:45 ET by Luke Kolin

Anthony Kring wrote:

Whatever. Looks like I won't be getting anywhere with this issue.

The only way you're going to get anywhere is to run the page in Chrome Developer tools. On the network tab, once the page is loaded select "Save as HAR with Content" and send me the HAR file.

Most pages load content from at least four different sites; the ACARS map may be loading from twice as many. A slow page can be the result of a variety of things; merely checking the end to end ping times won't do too much. Given that it's affecting ACARS as well it's likely at the network level but the HAR timeline will give me some clues as to how to direct Google tech support.

Cheers!

Luke Kolin

Senior Captain, MD-11

Posted onPost created on May 27 2017 16:17 ET by Anthony Kring

Luke - Sent via email. Sorry for delay.

Anthony Kring

Captain, B777-200

Posted onPost created on May 29 2017 12:48 ET by Luke Kolin

Thanks. That's a fascinating trace - it's like the server was waiting for a long period of time. Here's the server side logs with your IP address obfuscated:

2605:a601:afe:9a00:: - [27/May/2017:20:13:57 +0000] "GET / HTTP/2.0" 200 8175 18711291 "Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.110 Safari/537.36" "-" (37) TLSv1.2
2605:a601:afe:9a00:: - [27/May/2017:20:14:16 +0000] "GET /css/v597/legacy/main-min.css HTTP/2.0" 200 1730 5617601 "Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.110 Safari/537.36" "-" (29) TLSv1.2
2605:a601:afe:9a00:: - [27/May/2017:20:14:16 +0000] "GET /css/v597/legacy/view-min.css HTTP/2.0" 200 411 5617942 "Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.110 Safari/537.36" "-" (31) TLSv1.2
2605:a601:afe:9a00:: - [27/May/2017:20:14:16 +0000] "GET /js/v597/common-min.js HTTP/2.0" 200 3474 5618452 "Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.110 Safari/537.36" "-" (28) TLSv1.2
2605:a601:afe:9a00:: - [27/May/2017:20:14:16 +0000] "GET /img/DeltaBanner.png HTTP/2.0" 200 10434 5618708 "Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.110 Safari/537.36" "-" (-) TLSv1.2
2605:a601:afe:9a00:: - [27/May/2017:20:14:16 +0000] "GET /img/IPv6_128.png HTTP/2.0" 200 1782 10632207 "Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.110 Safari/537.36" "-" (-) TLSv1.2
2605:a601:afe:9a00:: - [27/May/2017:20:14:16 +0000] "GET /img/network/vatsim_button.png HTTP/2.0" 200 3826 10632246 "Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.110 Safari/537.36" "-" (-) TLSv1.2

The interesting value is the one right before the User agent string - it's the time taken to serve the request in microseconds. It definitely matches the trace you sent me. What's odd is that every request except the first is a static file, and serving it takes almost no server resources at all. You should go back to Google, send them this post, including the following entries:

2605:a000:1230:e0ad:: - [27/May/2017:01:14:41 +0000] "GET /img/DeltaBanner.png HTTP/2.0" 304 0 58850 "Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; Android 4.4.2; SM-T230NU Build/KOT49H) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.83 Safari/537.36" "-" (-) TLSv1.2
2605:a000:1230:e0ad:: - [27/May/2017:01:14:42 +0000] "GET /img/spinner_legacy.gif HTTP/2.0" 304 0 313 "Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; Android 4.4.2; SM-T230NU Build/KOT49H) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.83 Safari/537.36" "-" (-) TLSv1.2
2605:a000:1230:e0ad:: - [27/May/2017:01:14:42 +0000] "GET /js/v594/common-min.js HTTP/2.0" 200 3474 632 "Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; Android 4.4.2; SM-T230NU Build/KOT49H) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.83 Safari/537.36" "-" (28) TLSv1.2
2605:a000:1230:e0ad:: - [27/May/2017:01:14:42 +0000] "GET /css/v594/legacy/main-min.css HTTP/2.0" 200 1730 627 "Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; Android 4.4.2; SM-T230NU Build/KOT49H) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.83 Safari/537.36" "-" (29) TLSv1.2
2605:a000:1230:e0ad:: - [27/May/2017:01:14:43 +0000] "GET /css/v594/legacy/form-min.css HTTP/2.0" 200 702 512 "Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; Android 4.4.2; SM-T230NU Build/KOT49H) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.83 Safari/537.36" "-" (32) TLSv1.2
2605:a000:1230:e0ad:: - [27/May/2017:01:14:46 +0000] "GET /css/v594/legacy/view-min.css HTTP/2.0" 200 411 517 "Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; Android 4.4.2; SM-T230NU Build/KOT49H) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.83 Safari/537.36" "-" (31) TLSv1.2
2605:a000:1230:e0ad:: - [27/May/2017:01:14:47 +0000] "GET /img/spinner_delta_2007.gif HTTP/2.0" 304 0 343 "Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; Android 4.4.2; SM-T230NU Build/KOT49H) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.83 Safari/537.36" "-" (-) TLSv1.2
2605:a000:1230:e0ad:: - [27/May/2017:01:14:47 +0000] "GET /css/v593/legacy/main-min.css HTTP/2.0" 200 1730 523 "Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; Android 4.4.2; SM-T230NU Build/KOT49H) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.83 Safari/537.36" "-" (29) TLSv1.2
2605:a000:1230:e0ad:: - [27/May/2017:01:14:47 +0000] "GET /js/v593/common-min.js HTTP/2.0" 200 3474 569 "Mozilla/5.0 (Linux; Android 4.4.2; SM-T230NU Build/KOT49H) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Chrome/58.0.3029.83 Safari/537.36" "-" (28) TLSv1.2

I'm definitely responding quickly to IPv6 (and I think this is one of Google's netblocks). If they claim the problem is on the server end, I assume they were able to duplicate it?

Cheers!

Luke Kolin

Senior Captain, MD-11

Posted onPost created on May 29 2017 13:13 ET by Luke Kolin

I am also curious what you get when you hit https://www.gvagroup.org

Cheers!

Luke Kolin

Senior Captain, MD-11

DVA1909
Captain, B757-200

Joined on September 18 2004
Century Club

"Ang!"
Lakewood, CA

167 legs, 500.3 hours
3 legs, 5.8 hours online
104 legs, 337.5 hours ACARS

Posted onPost created on June 21 2017 16:54 ET by Colin Stave

I was having a similar issue with slow response from deltava.org and acars. The registry fix Andrew linked above absolutely did the trick! One difference: as far as I know I'm not on google fiber unless it is somehow a third party to my provider, TimeWarner (recently joining Spectrum/Charter). So I thought I would share here in case this helps people narrow in on the problem. I don't have enough internet savvy to understand any of the trace processes and such, but I'm happy to provide information if people are able to walk me through how to extract it.

In any case, thank you guys for working out a workable solution to this problem!

Colin Stave (DVA1909)

Posted onPost created on June 22 2017 10:29 ET by Andrew Vane

Funny I had the same slowdown on my home google fiber network with my work laptop. I did the registry fix and voila! Works fine. I don't or cant do it on my phone so I just go on data on my android to avoid the slowdown.

Andrew Vane (DVA2887)

Posted onPost created on July 13 2017 10:47 ET by Luke Kolin

I've done some tweaking to our DNS caching. Please re-enable IPv6 and try again.

Cheers!

Luke Kolin

Senior Captain, MD-11

Posted onPost created on July 13 2017 14:30 ET by Andrew Vane

I will give it a try on my google fiber network. Thanks for troubleshooting Luke.

Andrew Vane (DVA2887)

Posted onPost created on July 16 2017 08:14 ET by Andrew Vane

I can report that the first time I go to the web page, it takes a while. Then, links open quickly.

Andrew Vane (DVA2887)

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